Stuart Published on December 17, 2007
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Choose your colour space carefully for Ipernity

Monday December 17, 2007 at 08:08PM

I have been wondering for a while now why my beautiful colour photographs end up looking desaturated and washed out every time I upload them to Ipernity (and Flickr for that matter). Below is an example of what I'm talking about:

ipernity colour
ipernity colour

The image on the right is how my photo looks in lightroom, the one on the left is what happens when I send it to Ipernity; big difference. This obviously frustrated me because I just was not able to convey what I needed to in terms of colour and saturation and pictures with impact ended up pretty average.

Tonight I embarked on an experiment to try and find out why.

When I export from Lightroom, from RAW (NEF) to JPG I can choose one of 3 options: sRGB, AdobeRGB (1998) and ProPhoto RGB. Without being a guru of color spaces, sRGB is the standard proposed by Microsoft and HP in 1995 for print and web; proPhoto is a standard developed by Kodak for photographic output and is the largest of the colour spaces and AdobeRGB was developed in 1998 to encompass the colours achievable on CMYK printers. For the more technically minded here is an article detailing why proPhoto RGB is far superior to the others.

Anyway the trouble seems to lie in how the photo-sharing websites handle the different colour spaces. Flickr and Ipernity (and I would love clarification on this) seem to handle the sRGB colour space quite well but their interpretations of the other two leave a lot to be desired squarely with how the browsers handle the colour spaces (see Don's comment below) - Safari is the only browser to display these images correctly. The proof of the pudding is in the eating and here are 3 of the same photos exported using the different colour profiles.

1. Worst is Prophoto RGB (although this is the preferred colour space for photography)

Prophoto RGB
Prophoto RGB

2. In second place comes AdobeRGB (better but not quite there)

Adobe RGB
Adobe RGB

3. The best overall representation comes from the older sRGB which is a pity really.

Pine and Mist (sRGB)
Pine and Mist (sRGB)

In closing, none of these gives a true representation of what I see on the screen for some unknown reason. The truest approximation can be seen in the screen shot at the start of this article and that was a screen grab ... maybe some colour deity can explain this to me.

Save sRGB when you export from Lightroom and other software to have the best possible representation of your photo on Ipernity and let's hope the photo websites non-Safari browsers all get their Prophoto RGB ducks in a row sometime soon.

 

12 Comments / add your comment?

Bigoode [Frozen account]pro says:
This is the main problem of computer photo sharing !
it's not paper !
so it's not real colors ....
We have to deal with this and remind that pix have to be printed ;-) (i guess)
very interesting post !
thanks Stuart, i wish you to find some peacefull moments ;-)
Shine on

--
Seen in a user home page (?)
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Stuart replies:
Thanks Anthony, hope you do too and you come right with your D300 :)
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Bigoode [Frozen account]pro replies:
I still dream about the D300, but i firstly want to improve skills, i have time before owning such a camera..... :s
lol
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Rob Youngpro says:
This has been an issue for a few people lately. There is a good article (actually a series of articles) on colour management at:

www.imagescience.com.au/Knowledge/DFP/DFP.html

It is mostly aimed at preparing an image for printing but covers the basics of colour management.

As I understand it, sRGB is the safest colour space to use because the majority of display devices (monitors) interpret this colour information the same way.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Stuart replies:
Thanks Rob, I'm certainly no expert so I'll take the time to look through your link and try and understand it all better. It seems that sRGB is the way to go for web although I will stick to Prophoto RGB for my prints as the colour does seem richer.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Rob Youngpro replies:
Yep, the issue of printing acurately is a whole different issue. I would be more than happy to discuss it with you when you get here.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Jerry Lee says:
that was my first question in my first post to the blog, now its deleted ...
other than colour-space, ipernity down-samples the jpeg compression further, meaning if you download your original of your post, you'll get a smaller size file. Like bigoode pointed out, thats the fact of life with computers, the ideal is only a fragment of our imagination ...
even in real world with ink and paper, colour matching is only a laboratory exercise, all colours are viewed with surrounding colours reflected on them as in "Ray-Tracing"
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Rob Youngpro replies:
Thanks, I suspected that. I upload fairly small files anyway and I have noticed they look even softer when displayed.

The originals are sharp, honest! :-)
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Дон Андреpro says:
It's not ipernity that is to blame, but your browser. Ipernity doesn't modify the colour of your image. If you're on a Mac (you seem to be) try Safari and you'll see the colours as you intended them. Safari is the only browser that interprets the colour space correctly. All other browsers assume that the picture is in sRGB and ignore the colour space information.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Stuart replies:
Wow Don, thanks for that, you're right - they all look great in Safari (especially the proPhoto RGB) .... mmmh that is a very poor show from the other lot especially Firefox (tut tut!!!). Thanks for that tip, however until the other lot get their respective colour acts sorted out I will keep using sRGB.

I've updated the post with due kudos to the one who solved the mystery, thanks again.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Stuart edited this comment 11 months ago.
Дон Андреpro replies:
There was also a recent post about this in the blog of Neontiger, read here: www.ipernity.com/blog/neontiger/32519

And I agree, Firefox could really improve here.
The topic regarding the different colour spaces and which to choose is complex. The basic essence is that a larger colour space (such as AdobeRGB) will give you a greater choice of different colours, but less fine steps, whereas a smaller colour space (such as sRGB) will leave you with a little less different colours, but more and finer steps between them. The reason is that each colour space can encode only the same number of 16,7 million colours with 24bit (RGB = 3x8bit)
But how each monitor displays this information and how the printer interprets it (printers are using CMYK and not RGB) is something that I don't know about either.
When you read a little bit about HDR you'll realize that whatever change there'll be (e.g. going to 16bit per channel), it will affect the whole chain from image capture to image display. As I understood it, our everyday LCD's are still so bad at displaying colour that sRGB is more than enough.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )
Jerry Lee says:
But on Ipernity, theres a statement somewhere that firefox is preferred over safari ...
i use safari but have problems with text handling and send mail functions, appears Ipernity server does not accept HTML from safari either.
Posted 11 months ago. ( permalink )

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